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	<title>Comments on: More free energy now.</title>
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	<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/</link>
	<description>Ben Goldacre&#039;s Bad Science column from the Guardian and more...</description>
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		<title>By: ggkate</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-32970</link>
		<dc:creator>ggkate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jun 2010 02:17:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-32970</guid>
		<description>aturday: I&#039;ve just read the Guardian version and it&#039;s been cut a bit, whole chunks missing, and bits r</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>aturday: I&#8217;ve just read the Guardian version and it&#8217;s been cut a bit, whole chunks missing, and bits r</p>
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		<title>By: ggkate</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-32968</link>
		<dc:creator>ggkate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Jun 2010 02:15:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-32968</guid>
		<description>hahahah</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hahahah</p>
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		<title>By: Snuggie</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-30892</link>
		<dc:creator>Snuggie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Feb 2010 08:47:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-30892</guid>
		<description>Snuggie blanket &lt;a href=&quot;//www.snuggieblanketsale.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Snuggie blanket&lt;/a&gt;
blanket with sleeves &lt;a href=&quot;//www.snuggieblanketsale.com/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;blanket with sleeves&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Snuggie blanket <a href="//www.snuggieblanketsale.com/" rel="nofollow">Snuggie blanket</a><br />
blanket with sleeves <a href="//www.snuggieblanketsale.com/" rel="nofollow">blanket with sleeves</a></p>
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		<title>By: diudiu</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-30173</link>
		<dc:creator>diudiu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Dec 2009 05:42:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-30173</guid>
		<description>ed hardy &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy clothing &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy clothing&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy clothing&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy jeans &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy jeans&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy jeans&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
christian audigier &lt;a title=&quot;christian audigier&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com/christian-audigier.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;christian audigier&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy t shirts &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy t shirts&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy t shirts&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy uk &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy uk&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy uk&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy bags &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy bags&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy bags&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy hoodies &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy hoodies&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy hoodies&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy mens &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy mens&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com/mens.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy mens&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy womens &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy womens&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com/womens.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy womens&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt;
ed hardy kids &lt;a title=&quot;ed hardy kids&quot; href=&quot;http://www.edhardyclub.com/kids.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;strong&gt;ed hardy kids&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/a&gt; ed hardy kids</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ed hardy <a title="ed hardy" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy</strong></a><br />
ed hardy clothing <a title="ed hardy clothing" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy clothing</strong></a><br />
ed hardy jeans <a title="ed hardy jeans" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy jeans</strong></a><br />
christian audigier <a title="christian audigier" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com/christian-audigier.html" rel="nofollow"><strong>christian audigier</strong></a><br />
ed hardy t shirts <a title="ed hardy t shirts" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy t shirts</strong></a><br />
ed hardy uk <a title="ed hardy uk" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy uk</strong></a><br />
ed hardy bags <a title="ed hardy bags" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy bags</strong></a><br />
ed hardy hoodies <a title="ed hardy hoodies" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy hoodies</strong></a><br />
ed hardy mens <a title="ed hardy mens" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com/mens.html" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy mens</strong></a><br />
ed hardy womens <a title="ed hardy womens" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com/womens.html" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy womens</strong></a><br />
ed hardy kids <a title="ed hardy kids" href="http://www.edhardyclub.com/kids.html" rel="nofollow"><strong>ed hardy kids</strong></a> ed hardy kids</p>
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		<title>By: fznidarsic</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-19547</link>
		<dc:creator>fznidarsic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 15:01:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-19547</guid>
		<description>I have read of this work by Elowatts.  I believe that it has a chance.  I am electrical engineer and a good one at that.  I have been studying new energy for 20 years.  I have found that there is one way to get new energy.  That way is though the control of all of the natural forces; gravity, nuclear, and electromagetism.  This can be done by harnessing the power of the quantum transition.  The natural forces interact strongly and at long range during the quantum transition.  

The quantum transtion is described by my theorem,  &quot;The constants of the motion tend toward the electromagnetic in a Bose condensate that is stimulated at a dimensional frequency of 1.094 megahertz-meters&quot;



It is possible to place a macroscopic object into a state of quantum transition.  The technoclogy usually involves electrolysis and palladium.  To read more, see pictures of other experiments, and learn a bit;  see my web page at:

http://www.angelfire.com/scifi2/zpt/cgi-bin/ZeroPointTechnologies.pl?Guard

or search for

&quot;Frank Znidarsic&quot;




enjoy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have read of this work by Elowatts.  I believe that it has a chance.  I am electrical engineer and a good one at that.  I have been studying new energy for 20 years.  I have found that there is one way to get new energy.  That way is though the control of all of the natural forces; gravity, nuclear, and electromagetism.  This can be done by harnessing the power of the quantum transition.  The natural forces interact strongly and at long range during the quantum transition.  </p>
<p>The quantum transtion is described by my theorem,  &#8220;The constants of the motion tend toward the electromagnetic in a Bose condensate that is stimulated at a dimensional frequency of 1.094 megahertz-meters&#8221;</p>
<p>It is possible to place a macroscopic object into a state of quantum transition.  The technoclogy usually involves electrolysis and palladium.  To read more, see pictures of other experiments, and learn a bit;  see my web page at:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.angelfire.com/scifi2/zpt/cgi-bin/ZeroPointTechnologies.pl?Guard" rel="nofollow">http://www.angelfire.com/scifi2/zpt/cgi-bin/ZeroPointTechnologies.pl?Guard</a></p>
<p>or search for</p>
<p>&#8220;Frank Znidarsic&#8221;</p>
<p>enjoy</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Carnegie</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18781</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Carnegie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2007 00:43:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18781</guid>
		<description>You may be aware that there are schemes to supply food materials from commercial users (supermarkets, catering) to certain charitable ventures in the same neighbourhood when it can&#039;t be used as originally intended.  But not everyone does this, not everything is covered, and I reckon that giving it away may interfere with the insurance claim if the insurer doesn&#039;t take an enlightened view.  For that matter you don&#039;t want someone from the homeless hostel thinking, I fancy toasted cheese tonight, I&#039;ll go into Tecswayburose and unplug the freezer accidentally and they&#039;ll give us the cheese when they find out what happened, it serves them right anyway.  I expect this is described online and perhaps I too will be published in the Daily Mail...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You may be aware that there are schemes to supply food materials from commercial users (supermarkets, catering) to certain charitable ventures in the same neighbourhood when it can&#8217;t be used as originally intended.  But not everyone does this, not everything is covered, and I reckon that giving it away may interfere with the insurance claim if the insurer doesn&#8217;t take an enlightened view.  For that matter you don&#8217;t want someone from the homeless hostel thinking, I fancy toasted cheese tonight, I&#8217;ll go into Tecswayburose and unplug the freezer accidentally and they&#8217;ll give us the cheese when they find out what happened, it serves them right anyway.  I expect this is described online and perhaps I too will be published in the Daily Mail&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Spanners</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18766</link>
		<dc:creator>Spanners</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Nov 2007 20:53:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18766</guid>
		<description>Scotlyn - I  apologise if  my remarks about the impact of technology on poverty may have seemed glib - Thankyou for your very informative comments - I agree that the issues of true poverty are complex . I think  I wanted to demonstrate that technology of the developed world even though controled and driven by big corporations does eventually &quot;trickle&quot; though to the developing world at a much lower cost by the conseqences of economics. It is heartening to known that the quality of life in Costa Rica apaers to be improving - and it is sad that crime is a consequence. I did know that transportation of waste food is tightly controlled for the reasons you give. If waste food could be made sterile by some technological means( I used  GM because it was mentioned)it could help feed  the developing world in a similar way to the reuse of our discarded phones and computers supplies them with &quot;cheap&quot; technology.

Robert - I agree wasting food should be avoided at all cost and thereby  the surplus generated fed to the starving. I recently and unashamefully rescued 28kg of vacuum wrapped cheese which had been, that very morning, thrown into a skip at the local supermarket. In total there was at least 150 Kgs or more in the skip. It was dumped because of a refridgeration falure. A criminal waste - and worse too the cheese had been &quot;priced up&quot; to yield a better insurance claim. This was food was perfect and could have been given to local charities. If this is just a small example of what happens weekly  across our country ,it beggars belief how wasteful or so called &quot;low priced&quot; food supply actually is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Scotlyn &#8211; I  apologise if  my remarks about the impact of technology on poverty may have seemed glib &#8211; Thankyou for your very informative comments &#8211; I agree that the issues of true poverty are complex . I think  I wanted to demonstrate that technology of the developed world even though controled and driven by big corporations does eventually &#8220;trickle&#8221; though to the developing world at a much lower cost by the conseqences of economics. It is heartening to known that the quality of life in Costa Rica apaers to be improving &#8211; and it is sad that crime is a consequence. I did know that transportation of waste food is tightly controlled for the reasons you give. If waste food could be made sterile by some technological means( I used  GM because it was mentioned)it could help feed  the developing world in a similar way to the reuse of our discarded phones and computers supplies them with &#8220;cheap&#8221; technology.</p>
<p>Robert &#8211; I agree wasting food should be avoided at all cost and thereby  the surplus generated fed to the starving. I recently and unashamefully rescued 28kg of vacuum wrapped cheese which had been, that very morning, thrown into a skip at the local supermarket. In total there was at least 150 Kgs or more in the skip. It was dumped because of a refridgeration falure. A criminal waste &#8211; and worse too the cheese had been &#8220;priced up&#8221; to yield a better insurance claim. This was food was perfect and could have been given to local charities. If this is just a small example of what happens weekly  across our country ,it beggars belief how wasteful or so called &#8220;low priced&#8221; food supply actually is.</p>
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		<title>By: pob</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18688</link>
		<dc:creator>pob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Nov 2007 19:56:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18688</guid>
		<description>Ben,

I&#039;ve just seen this on the Ecowatts site and wondering what your response is?

http://www.ecowatts.co.uk/files/Statement-on-Guardian-Article-iss-1.pdf

My presumption is you&#039;re pointing out the fact that they didn&#039;t have the science right then, their testing is likely to be no more equally valid now?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ben,</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve just seen this on the Ecowatts site and wondering what your response is?</p>
<p><a href="http://www.ecowatts.co.uk/files/Statement-on-Guardian-Article-iss-1.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.ecowatts.co.uk/files/Statement-on-Guardian-Article-iss-1.pdf</a></p>
<p>My presumption is you&#8217;re pointing out the fact that they didn&#8217;t have the science right then, their testing is likely to be no more equally valid now?</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Carnegie</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18664</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Carnegie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Nov 2007 00:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18664</guid>
		<description>Ah, I missed the point and confused GM and GSM...  I think developing countries quickly end up having more mobile phones than the non-mobile kind.  As for non-perishable food, quite a lot can be dried and preserved - no GM required for that.  I don&#039;t recommend this for sending table scraps to tropical places, however.  Not wasting food at all, seems better to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, I missed the point and confused GM and GSM&#8230;  I think developing countries quickly end up having more mobile phones than the non-mobile kind.  As for non-perishable food, quite a lot can be dried and preserved &#8211; no GM required for that.  I don&#8217;t recommend this for sending table scraps to tropical places, however.  Not wasting food at all, seems better to me.</p>
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		<title>By: scotlyn</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18656</link>
		<dc:creator>scotlyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Nov 2007 21:04:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18656</guid>
		<description>Spanners - Interesting thought on the recycling of our waste food to the people of third world countries (you may not know that it is currently illegal - since the foot and mouth scare in the UK - for us to recycle our waste food by feeding it to our own pigs on our own farm).  I cannot speak for many countries, but I recently returned to visit Costa Rica, the country I spent my childhood in during the 1960&#039;s and 70&#039;s, to find many changes.  Great changes were afoot in my old neighbourhood, which, in my time, was mainly populated by tin shacks with dirt floors and outdoor pit toilets and, for the more enterprising, horrific-looking homemade direct connections to overhead mains power lines, with as-expected rates of electrocution incidents. Now, my neighbours, many of whom are still the same people, live in block houses with tile floors and indoor plumbing.  The children now all wear shoes and do not have the stick arms/legs and enlarged bellies which were formerly common.  The general levels of nutrition and comfort are up, the level of computer/phone use is up, so is theft - most of these small houses also sport iron bars on all doors and windows. My old neighbours are still, relative to us, poor.  However, relative to their former state, and to one another, they are not.  However, true poverty is complex, and in many ways intractable, and the truly poor and hungry still exist in Costa Rica as elsewhere - and, so far as I could see, such people did not have mobile phones or computers, or very much of anything else.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Spanners &#8211; Interesting thought on the recycling of our waste food to the people of third world countries (you may not know that it is currently illegal &#8211; since the foot and mouth scare in the UK &#8211; for us to recycle our waste food by feeding it to our own pigs on our own farm).  I cannot speak for many countries, but I recently returned to visit Costa Rica, the country I spent my childhood in during the 1960&#8242;s and 70&#8242;s, to find many changes.  Great changes were afoot in my old neighbourhood, which, in my time, was mainly populated by tin shacks with dirt floors and outdoor pit toilets and, for the more enterprising, horrific-looking homemade direct connections to overhead mains power lines, with as-expected rates of electrocution incidents. Now, my neighbours, many of whom are still the same people, live in block houses with tile floors and indoor plumbing.  The children now all wear shoes and do not have the stick arms/legs and enlarged bellies which were formerly common.  The general levels of nutrition and comfort are up, the level of computer/phone use is up, so is theft &#8211; most of these small houses also sport iron bars on all doors and windows. My old neighbours are still, relative to us, poor.  However, relative to their former state, and to one another, they are not.  However, true poverty is complex, and in many ways intractable, and the truly poor and hungry still exist in Costa Rica as elsewhere &#8211; and, so far as I could see, such people did not have mobile phones or computers, or very much of anything else.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert Carnegie</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18634</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert Carnegie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Nov 2007 23:48:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18634</guid>
		<description>GM feeding the world was the subject of debate on BBC World Service&#039;s [Discovery] on 21st November:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/programmes/discovery.shtml

With links to &quot;for&quot; and &quot;against&quot; arguments.

The precautionary principle can be taken too far, but I&#039;m wealthy enough to be able to refuse GM products and not starve, and I intend to continue to do so.  In fact, on imported goods I look for organic -and- fair trade indicators.  (You don&#039;t get them on clothes though - I did find People Tree, but their menswear range is small and only includes office wear if your boss is very tolerant.)  I figure that on overseas goods, organic excludes a multitude of horrors.

The other news from the [Discovery] programme is a claim that the public sector in the foremost developing countries is involved in developing GMOs, which ought to give some more confidence in the motive behind it.  Then again... someone somewhere maybe is engineering meaner mosquitoes and locusts to unleash on bordering countries.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>GM feeding the world was the subject of debate on BBC World Service&#8217;s [Discovery] on 21st November:<br />
<a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/programmes/discovery.shtml" rel="nofollow">http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/programmes/discovery.shtml</a></p>
<p>With links to &#8220;for&#8221; and &#8220;against&#8221; arguments.</p>
<p>The precautionary principle can be taken too far, but I&#8217;m wealthy enough to be able to refuse GM products and not starve, and I intend to continue to do so.  In fact, on imported goods I look for organic -and- fair trade indicators.  (You don&#8217;t get them on clothes though &#8211; I did find People Tree, but their menswear range is small and only includes office wear if your boss is very tolerant.)  I figure that on overseas goods, organic excludes a multitude of horrors.</p>
<p>The other news from the [Discovery] programme is a claim that the public sector in the foremost developing countries is involved in developing GMOs, which ought to give some more confidence in the motive behind it.  Then again&#8230; someone somewhere maybe is engineering meaner mosquitoes and locusts to unleash on bordering countries.</p>
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		<title>By: Spanners</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18629</link>
		<dc:creator>Spanners</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Nov 2007 22:41:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18629</guid>
		<description>I draw a parallel here to GSM technology ( yes mobile phones)
What if  GM technology can eventually produce food that does not perish? The starving millions could then be fed on our waste!!!
How is it many in the third world have computers and  mobile phones but nothing to eat!!?  GSM technology is also patentable by large corporations and trademark sold profitably ( very)  at a significant cost to those that can afford to eat. We throw our  perfectly good phones and computers  away thats why!. Note that GSM technology  has been also attacked on safety issues but it is the relentless demand  that has won through by providing this advanced technology at a price we can afford. 
I fear that we will all be fed by some brown powder as cheap as dirt to produce as the earths nutrional resources buckle under the strain of an ever expanding population.
Anyway forget all that!!! - lack of water is the to watch - Unless --------- we can do GM on a bug to desalinate water that wont wiping us out!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I draw a parallel here to GSM technology ( yes mobile phones)<br />
What if  GM technology can eventually produce food that does not perish? The starving millions could then be fed on our waste!!!<br />
How is it many in the third world have computers and  mobile phones but nothing to eat!!?  GSM technology is also patentable by large corporations and trademark sold profitably ( very)  at a significant cost to those that can afford to eat. We throw our  perfectly good phones and computers  away thats why!. Note that GSM technology  has been also attacked on safety issues but it is the relentless demand  that has won through by providing this advanced technology at a price we can afford.<br />
I fear that we will all be fed by some brown powder as cheap as dirt to produce as the earths nutrional resources buckle under the strain of an ever expanding population.<br />
Anyway forget all that!!! &#8211; lack of water is the to watch &#8211; Unless &#8212;&#8212;&#8212; we can do GM on a bug to desalinate water that wont wiping us out!</p>
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		<title>By: scotlyn</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18567</link>
		<dc:creator>scotlyn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Nov 2007 20:09:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18567</guid>
		<description>Marcdraco said: &quot;You did say the Daily Mail then… the bastion of accuracy! Hell, these are the people who think the world was created in 7 days and that GM food is bad (and bugger the starving millions in the third world).  
The sad thing is people read this drivel.&quot;  I just think it&#039;s worth pointing out that the issue of creationism and the issue of GM food may not be on the same playing field.  GM food may be as healthy as you like to eat (I agree evidence is at best inconclusive on this point to date), but since its development depends on large corporations patenting property rights for it, it certainly does not lend itself to feeding the starving millions - who are primarily starving because they do not have enough money to buy enough food and certainly will continue in the foreseeable future to lack the money to buy food that comes with a trademark label.  Can&#039;t understand why this debate always gets bogged down in safety issues, when the real problem is property rights and the threat to our food security when we hand ownership of it over to large corporations.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcdraco said: &#8220;You did say the Daily Mail then… the bastion of accuracy! Hell, these are the people who think the world was created in 7 days and that GM food is bad (and bugger the starving millions in the third world).<br />
The sad thing is people read this drivel.&#8221;  I just think it&#8217;s worth pointing out that the issue of creationism and the issue of GM food may not be on the same playing field.  GM food may be as healthy as you like to eat (I agree evidence is at best inconclusive on this point to date), but since its development depends on large corporations patenting property rights for it, it certainly does not lend itself to feeding the starving millions &#8211; who are primarily starving because they do not have enough money to buy enough food and certainly will continue in the foreseeable future to lack the money to buy food that comes with a trademark label.  Can&#8217;t understand why this debate always gets bogged down in safety issues, when the real problem is property rights and the threat to our food security when we hand ownership of it over to large corporations.</p>
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		<title>By: Spanners</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18102</link>
		<dc:creator>Spanners</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 19:21:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18102</guid>
		<description>100% correct Crispy!! - all electrical energy supplied to the immersion heater becomes heat.  This is the principle of a water calorimeter used to measure energy.Properly insulated such a device provides an indication of energy flowing into it by the time taken to raise a known volume of water through a temperature change.
Interestingly, similar claims for  &quot;over unity&quot; in the heating of water have been claimed by others using a device called a &quot;water hammer&quot;  This device  basically thrashes the hell out of a body of water using a rotating impeller driven by an electric motor. The energy represented by the rise in temperature of the water due to the mechanical / friction stress in the water is supposed to be greater than the electrical  energy supplied to the motor. Seems so simple to make - why dont we have water hammers instead of immersion heaters -  errrrrm??? must be all that noise I guess!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>100% correct Crispy!! &#8211; all electrical energy supplied to the immersion heater becomes heat.  This is the principle of a water calorimeter used to measure energy.Properly insulated such a device provides an indication of energy flowing into it by the time taken to raise a known volume of water through a temperature change.<br />
Interestingly, similar claims for  &#8220;over unity&#8221; in the heating of water have been claimed by others using a device called a &#8220;water hammer&#8221;  This device  basically thrashes the hell out of a body of water using a rotating impeller driven by an electric motor. The energy represented by the rise in temperature of the water due to the mechanical / friction stress in the water is supposed to be greater than the electrical  energy supplied to the motor. Seems so simple to make &#8211; why dont we have water hammers instead of immersion heaters &#8211;  errrrrm??? must be all that noise I guess!</p>
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		<title>By: Crispy Duck</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18101</link>
		<dc:creator>Crispy Duck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:52:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18101</guid>
		<description>In reply to myself, I suppose that that&#039;s why they have to claim over-unity in order to claim that they have higher efficiency - doh.

In any case, am I correct that any electrical heater is essentially 100% efficient?  It&#039;s the only application where heat isn&#039;t a by-product.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to myself, I suppose that that&#8217;s why they have to claim over-unity in order to claim that they have higher efficiency &#8211; doh.</p>
<p>In any case, am I correct that any electrical heater is essentially 100% efficient?  It&#8217;s the only application where heat isn&#8217;t a by-product.</p>
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		<title>By: Crispy Duck</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18100</link>
		<dc:creator>Crispy Duck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:50:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18100</guid>
		<description>From the Ecowatts website: &quot;...energy cell that converts electrical power into heat at an efficiency significantly greater than that of a conventional immersion heater.&quot;

How is that possible?  Surely the efficiency of an immersion heater is 100%, ie all the consumed energy is converted to heat.  If it&#039;s less than 100%, where does the rest of the energy go?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the Ecowatts website: &#8220;&#8230;energy cell that converts electrical power into heat at an efficiency significantly greater than that of a conventional immersion heater.&#8221;</p>
<p>How is that possible?  Surely the efficiency of an immersion heater is 100%, ie all the consumed energy is converted to heat.  If it&#8217;s less than 100%, where does the rest of the energy go?</p>
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		<title>By: zlsiida</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18099</link>
		<dc:creator>zlsiida</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:31:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18099</guid>
		<description>The cartoonist who does xkcd.com (very good for geeks) has a Tshirt for sale that says &quot;Stand back! I&#039;m going to try SCIENCE!&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The cartoonist who does <a href="http://xkcd.com" title="http://xkcd.com" target="_blank">xkcd.com</a> (very good for geeks) has a Tshirt for sale that says &#8220;Stand back! I&#8217;m going to try SCIENCE!&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: zlsiida</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18098</link>
		<dc:creator>zlsiida</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:22:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18098</guid>
		<description>I think the breakfast tv host + email thing was Armstrong &amp; Miller, not Serafinowicz.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the breakfast tv host + email thing was Armstrong &amp; Miller, not Serafinowicz.</p>
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		<title>By: Spanners</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18096</link>
		<dc:creator>Spanners</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Nov 2007 10:25:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18096</guid>
		<description>Will the acedemic establishments ( public funding - please note) that have been asked to look into this ever publish their findings or will they be too embarrased hoping we will all forget about it as yesterdays news? As  penance for their incompetence the BBC should make sure they follow this up!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will the acedemic establishments ( public funding &#8211; please note) that have been asked to look into this ever publish their findings or will they be too embarrased hoping we will all forget about it as yesterdays news? As  penance for their incompetence the BBC should make sure they follow this up!!</p>
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		<title>By: Zamzara</title>
		<link>http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/comment-page-2/#comment-18093</link>
		<dc:creator>Zamzara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Nov 2007 21:40:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.badscience.net/2007/11/free-energy/#comment-18093</guid>
		<description>Dermot should have checked it with the Eggheads.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dermot should have checked it with the Eggheads.</p>
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